Q: What if the particles in the double slit experiment were conscious? Could you ask them which slit they went through afterwards?

The original question was: I find the double slit experiment super interesting and have lots of questions about it. But here’s one.

What if the particles you send through the slits are conscious? You send them through without measuring anything, and see an interference pattern. Afterwards, can you ask them which slit they went through?

More generally, maybe someone far far away can somehow infer that I am in a superposition, eating chocolate and/or vanilla ice cream. Later on, could they come down here and tell me about it? And ask which one I thought I was eating?


Physicist: This is a beautiful question.

In the early 1800s Young first did his double slit experiment, showing that light is a wave; a fact that’s more interesting than mind blowing.  That was fine until the early 1900s, when a compounding of theoretical issues and empirical evidence revealed that light is also particle, in that it only seems to interact in discrete “quantized” chunks; a combination of facts more confusing than mind blowing.

An extremely good question, upon learning that light behaves like a particle, is to repeat the double slit experiment, but keep the light intensity so low that only a single photon is present at a time.  If the universe were sympathetic to the human plight or placed any value on the peaceful sleep of physicists, then the result of this experiment would be a transformation of the interference fringes into a pair of bumps, one for each slit, as the photons run out of other photons to interfere with.

Coherent light passing through a pair (or more) of slits generates patterns as the waves of light from the two slits “interfere” with each other.  The exact same pattern persists even when only a single photon is allowed through at a time (although it takes longer for the pattern to be clearly visible, since it’s built up one dot at a time).

When we actually do this experiment, we find that the same pattern continues to show up.  Evidently, each individual photon interferes with itself, as though it had gone though both slits; a realization that’s more mind blowing than anything else.

It’s this “superposition” property of photons that makes them fundamentally quantum and it’s responsible for interference.  An individual photon can pass through both slits and, although we can’t witness both versions of the photon, we can infer that they both existed through the interference pattern their combination forms.

It turns out that if there’s any way whatsoever to figure out which slit the photon went through, even if you don’t bother to find out, then there is no interference pattern.  If you know that the photon went through the left slit (and genuinely doesn’t matter how you know), then the pattern it follows impacting the screen will contain no contribution from the right slit.

For example, if you put perpendicular polarizers in front of the slits, then you can “mark” photons.  If the left slit is vertically polarized and the right is horizontal, then there’s no interference between the slits; we see two bumps, each made up of light from a particular slit with a particular polarization.  You don’t actually have to check the polarization of any photon; the fact that it’s possible to know for sure which slit the photon came from (by measuring it with a polarizer) means that the two paths are “distinguishable”.

If both slits have vertical polarizers, then all of the light is vertically polarized and there’s no way to tell which slit the photon came from.  Since the polarization of the photons is independent of which slit they went through, we see interference fringes again: many bright spots, two slits.  Notice that this means that the polarizers themselves don’t “damage” the state of the photons passong through.  The interference patterns really are dependent on the distinguishability of the slits.

So this may actually answer the question.  We can ask each photon which slit they just came from by measuring their polarization.  When the polarization state of the photons is used to “mark” them, they “remember” which slit they went through and there is no interference pattern.  When they “don’t remember”, then there is an interference pattern.  The photon’s polarization is being used here as a “pointer state”, and it’s a good way to talk about “memory”.

The term “pointer state” refers to a physical system that physical records a measurement result.  For example: the position of a thing that points.

This physical record is sometimes called a “pointer state”, referring to the actual, physical state of a pointer pointing at something.

Through out the 20th century we found that photons aren’t special.  Electrons, entire atoms, molecules with thousands of atoms, everything that has ever been directly tested has demonstrated interference effects as well as particle-like behavior, just like light.  In fact, with coherence times measured in minutes and entanglement established between continents, one begins to suspect that quantum mechanics may be the general rule.  What if everything, including us, is a quantum system?  What does it feel like to be in a superposition of eating chocolate and/or vanilla ice cream states?

In the “Wigner’s Friend” thought experiment, the Friend is asked to do some kind of quantum measurement, like opening Schrödinger’s Cat’s box, and then report the results to Wigner a little later.  The question is, does Wigner’s Friend’s observation of the Cat “collapse” its state, or do the Friend and Cat end up in a superposition of states together, alive/relieved and dead/horrified?

Remarkably, we may be able to answer that question experimentally without mentioning consciousness more than just this once.  We can talk about pointer states under the rather broad umbrella of “something that keeps a physical record of the result of a quantum measurement”, which includes conscious minds, trained dogs, chalkboards, particular arrangements of rocks, etc.  A conscious human mind is remarkable.  Fine.  But all we need here is “a brain includes a physical record of events”.  We can still feel superior, but for our purposes, the polarization state of a photon, a single qubit of information, is sufficient.

Brains are arguably better that chalkboards.  But even though brains can think and love and consider qualia and generally be conscious, the only thing that minds do that’s important for pointer states is remembering stuff.  Chalkboards can be used to “physically encode the result of a quantum measurement” just as well as a brain (or a rock), so they’re both good enough.

In “Experimental rejection of observer-independence in the quantum world” Wigner’s Friend is a clever device that measures and records the horizontal/vertical polarization of one photon onto another, using a combination of entangled photons, half and quarter wave plates, polarizing beam splitters, and single photon detectors (it was not easy).  This Friend is sealed inside an “information proof” Lab, like the box containing Schrödinger’s Cat.  The only record of the first photon’s state is the second photon, not some “Wigner’s Clipboard” left in the lab.  Finally, Wigner’s Friend can alert the outside world that a measurement has been successfully done, without reporting the result.

a, an incoming photon in and unknown state, enters Wigner’s Lab.  Wigner’s Friend measures the horizontal/vertical polarization of a by firing off two photons with the same polarization, b and c.  The polarizing beam splitter always reflects horizontal light and always passes vertical.  If a and b have the same polarization, then one photon will exit each branch of the beam splitter, either both vertical (and passing straight through) or both horizontal (and both reflected).  In that case, a and c have the same polarization, a in its original state and c in the same state; photon c carries a physical record of the state of a.  b is used to announce a successful measurement (a success is only counted when all three photons are detected, in their expected place).  So a detection-and-record isn’t usually successful, but we can tell when it works.

This is a bit of a digression, so if you’re interested, you can read a more detailed digression into this experiment here or read the original paper here.  Suffice it to say:

-Photon A goes into the Lab and gets measured in the horizontal/vertical direction, but is left undisturbed.  Whether horizontal or vertical, |\rightarrow\rangle or |\uparrow\rangle, the state of A is verifiably the same before and after passing through the Lab.

-Photons A and C emerge from the Lab, where the polarization of C is a copy of the result of a vertical/horizontal meansurement on A.  We can verify the output (say,two vertical states) given the input (say, one vertical state) easily.

|\uparrow\rangle_a\quad\longrightarrow\quad|\uparrow\rangle_a|\uparrow\rangle_c\quad\quad\quad|\rightarrow\rangle_a\quad\longrightarrow\quad|\rightarrow\rangle_a|\rightarrow\rangle_c.

-No other record of the state is kept.  This experiment is shockingly clean: a verifiably accurate measurement of a photon is done, the one and only record of that result is written onto another single photon, and the two are sent on their way.

The question is, what happens to Wigner’s Friend, when he’s given a diagonally polarized photon

|\nearrow\rangle = \frac{|\uparrow\rangle + |\rightarrow\rangle}{\sqrt{2}}

which is a equal superposition of vertical and horizontal polarization states?  Remarkably, Wigner’s Friend (the second photon) enters a superposition of states as well.

|\nearrow\rangle_a = \frac{|\uparrow\rangle_a + |\rightarrow\rangle_a}{\sqrt{2}}\quad\longrightarrow\quad\frac{|\uparrow\rangle_a|\uparrow\rangle_c + |\rightarrow\rangle_a|\rightarrow\rangle_c}{\sqrt{2}}

This is a Bell state!  It means that the original photon and the result of a measurement on it are entangled with each other.  Bell states are demonstrably non-classical, very quantum mechanical, phenomena.  Being in this Bell state means that, even though A and C are in a superposition of states, if one is later found to be, say, horizontal, then so will the other.  Regardless of the result, Wigner’s Friend still did the measurment accurately and only saw the one result.

The original photon is still in a superposition of states, and so is the result of the measurement on it.  It’s fairly simple to measure pairs of photons in the “Bell basis“, allowing us to tell the difference between |\nearrow\rangle_a and

|\nwarrow\rangle_a = \frac{|\uparrow\rangle_a - |\rightarrow\rangle_a}{\sqrt{2}}\quad\longrightarrow\quad\frac{|\uparrow\rangle_a|\uparrow\rangle_c - |\rightarrow\rangle_a|\rightarrow\rangle_c}{\sqrt{2}}

which is the other diagonally polarized state.

Evidently, measurment doesn’t collapse states, it entangles them.  The result of a measurement is not an objective thing!  It can be in a superposition of states just like everything else.  Assuming quantum laws are universal (they seem to be) and assuming we, our memories, are pointer states (it’s hard not to be), and assuming that it’s possible to “information isolate” people from each other (in the extreme, zero-information sense of the physical experiment), then we can describe what it would be like to be Wigner’s Friend.

Taking the photon experiment as guide, we’ll consider a perfectly-isolated Lab that includes an ice cream machine that dispenses either vanilla or chocolate depending on the result of a polarization measurement of a single incoming photon.  We can feel confident that if we feed in a |\nearrow\rangle = \frac{|\uparrow\rangle + |\rightarrow\rangle}{\sqrt{2}} photon, then Wigner’s Friend will eat a superposition of flavors \frac{|\uparrow\rangle|vanilla\rangle + |\rightarrow\rangle|chocolate\rangle}{\sqrt{2}}.  However, if you asked Wigner’s Friend what he experienced, he’d tell you an answer; either vanilla or chocolate, but not both.  He doesn’t experience the superposition as anything strange.

 

In the last few years we’ve managed to establish entanglement between continents using intermediating satellites.  With a huge effort, we could set up something like that between Earth and Mars.  Here on Earth the result of measurements on these entangled pairs would be used for ice cream choices and on Mars, sheilded by the fact that information can’t travel faster than light, uses their entangled pairs to infer that people on Earth (the ice cream eater, at least) are in superpositions.  This isn’t a useful trick.  When you actually ask “what flavor did you get?”, you’ll get a direct, non-quantum answer.  But technically, you could be confident that someone on the far end of your entangled pair is eating a superposition of flavors.  Until you can talk to them.  Even if you don’t.

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17 Responses to Q: What if the particles in the double slit experiment were conscious? Could you ask them which slit they went through afterwards?

  1. Stephen Cox says:

    I read the question and the answer with interest, and as always was amazed at quantum effects.
    I understand that the addition of “consciousness” was seen simply in terms of a “recorded measurement” – a memory “bit” – or “qbit”?

    To restate:
    the system always acts in a way which takes account of whether a qbit has been altered (or interacted with) or not. If not, interference / entanglement will be the state.

    I look at this as a further illustration of Lewis’s view of photon events:
    the photon cannot be “emitted” unless the destination of the photon is “known” – i.e. a qbit has been altered. This follows from the non-passage of time for the photon during its life (because its velocity is c).
    this results in the photons in the double slit experiment having to “know” the full details of their path(s) through the apparatus at the point of emission. Although the observer can measure time passing while the photon magically goes through both slits at once, relativity ensures that this does not affect the photon in any way. It might be suggested that the photon traced every path between origin and screen – infinite lengths of path taking no time for itself.
    (The *actual* time taken for the photon is determined by the distance between source and origin from the observer’s POV, of course).
    As a red herring, is there any data measuring the differences in arrival time in the double slit experiment (i.e does the arrival time vary depending on the exact “line” traced by the photon to its “collapsed” end point – which may be on one of several fringes?)

  2. Martin Alpert says:

    Reset of the observer (ability to make an observation), rather than the observation may help explain this quantum mechanical mechanism. Energy in computation is not used during the computation, but in reset. A similar mechanism may be occurring in quantum
    mechanics. It is described in a 10 minute YouTube:

  3. Don’t polarizers work not by “marking” photons, but by absorbing incorrectly polarized photons?

    What if a photon (or electron) is neither a wave nor a particle, but something else? Let’s use electrons. What if it’s incorrect to say that the electron goes through one slit or the other. What if the electron simply passes the barrier, or gets absorbed by it. What if a “two slit” barrier simply selects a certain subset of electrons, but that subset has some property that gives you the interference pattern? What if any observation of (i.e., any physical interaction with) the electron necessarily changes that property?

  4. If you want to maintain superposition/entanglement of dead/live-cats, it’s not just two states entangled, but a cat entangle with state of box for each time the cat could have died — could be an infinite number.

    Seems absurd.

  5. David says:

    This article is a confusing mixture of known facts that are unexplained, and the writer’s own particular interpretation of them. He says:

    “If you know that the photon went through the left slit (and it genuinely doesn’t matter how you know), then the pattern it follows impacting the screen will contain no contribution from the right slit.”

    Some of that is guesswork – he doesn’t know that ‘it genuinely doesn’t matter how you know’. That’s what he happens to think, but a lot of very good physicists disagree.

  6. David says:

    Stephen Cox’s post has an error in it (or this is one of several). Relativity doesn’t say that a photon does not experience time. Special relativity gives the rules for matter, but not necessarily for light. Light doesn’t go by these rules, for one example, it has energy but no mass. The mass-energy equivalence is for matter, not light.

    If matter could travel at c, it would not experience time. Good physicists know that applying that to light is a bad idea, because it isn’t necessarily applicable.

  7. Error: Unable to create directory uploads/2024/12. Is its parent directory writable by the server? The Physicist says:

    @James of Seattle
    You’re exactly right. I went back and forth about whether to talk about just polarizers or polarization rotators. The rotators could rotate the polarization of each slit in opposite directions by 45°, so that the versions of the photon going through each slit will have perpendicular polarizations. Neither is destroyed, but since they’re marked the interference goes away. That technique is actually how the quantum eraser experiment was originally set up.
    I thought polarizing filters would be a bit more straight forward, but should probably go back and rewrite that.

  8. Error: Unable to create directory uploads/2024/12. Is its parent directory writable by the server? The Physicist says:

    @Arthur Snyder
    Even when doing the double slit experiment, in order to get really accurate prediction you have to worry about every possible path through both slits (so their shape is important as well). So far, to within our ludicrously precise ability to measure, there doesn’t seem to be a limit to how many states need to be taken into account. It may not be infinite, but it is a (admittedly absurdly) large number.

  9. Error: Unable to create directory uploads/2024/12. Is its parent directory writable by the server? The Physicist says:

    @David
    You’re right and that’s fair: I am extrapolating. But we’ve had a century to try every means of detection anyone can think of (and physically realize) in every scenario (not just photons and slits) and to date there hasn’t been any deviation in the slightest degree: if you can determine, even in theory, the state of a system, then it will not exhibit superposition.

  10. Error: Unable to create directory uploads/2024/12. Is its parent directory writable by the server? The Physicist says:

    @Stephen Cox
    Yes, you can measure the travel time even when multiple paths are used. However! You can use travel time to mark the slit; if you know exactly when the photon was emitted and absorbed, then you may be able to determine which slit the photon went through (since one path may need to be a little longer or shorter). However! Most emission processes involve some fundamental uncertainty in the emission time. In the exact same sense that a photon can pass through both slits, a photon has a superposition of creation and arrival times.

  11. Neruz says:

    So what I’m taking away from this is that if you can determine the state of a system then you are entangled with that system and thus cannot detect the influence of superposition upon it.

  12. Error: Unable to create directory uploads/2024/12. Is its parent directory writable by the server? The Physicist says:

    @Neruz
    That’s the long and the short of it. Once you’re entangled with something you can’t see it in multiple states any more than you can see yourself in multiple states.

  13. Josh Auten says:

    What if we didn’t watch the experiment & instead only listened to it? Would it stay the same or change ?

  14. Josh Auten says:

    I never really read any email. If somebody knows please text me the answer if possible? 303-909-324two…..thanx !!! Josh Auten

  15. Henrik Mudd says:

    If we strip away the human element from the term observation and take it to mean any physical interaction, isn’t this entire premise crushed under it’s own weight? Take the famous cat thought experiment for instance, why isn’t it’s state immediately collapsed by the gazillion neutrinos colliding with it? Or the tens of thousands of muons?

  16. Etta Valery Ayamba says:

    Ok

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